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The Verde Independent | Cottonwood, Arizona

home : opinions : letters August 25, 2016


8/2/2014 1:24:00 PM
Letter: We serve the residents of Verde Village with respect, courtesy and friendliness

Editor:

This letter is in response to M. Lloyd's letter of July 22, 2014. The Board of Directors and the Architectural Control Committee of the Verde Village Property Owner's Association (VVPOA) feel we must respond to Ms. Lloyd's vicious attack on our procedures, actions, and our permitting process.

Ms. Lloyd has received copies of the CC&Rs, By-Laws, September 3rd, 2013 minutes where requiring permits for solar installations were approved by the Board, and a copy of the Architectural Control Committee charter outline the authority of the Committee.

The first problem with Ms. Lloyd's letter is she continually refers to our "homeowners association." She refers to SB 1254, ARS Statute 33-1816 - all regulatory statutes for the homeowners' associations. The VVPOA is not a homeowners' association (HOA) - we are a property owners association, and these statutes she refers to do not apply to the VVPOA. She also states that she never received any documents regarding the VVPOA advising her of our Association when she purchased her home.

It is a requirement that at closing, prospective buyers must be advised that they will be living in the confines of the Verde Village, and to give them copies of the CC&R for their unit. Statute 44-1761 simply defines "solar devices." We do due diligence in keeping up with any laws affecting our association.

Ms. Lloyd refers to the VVPOA "profiting on permit fees." All fees collected by the VVPOA Architectural Control Committee (ACC) go into our General Fund, from which we pay our utilities, insurance, repairs to the Clubhouse, licenses and the general upkeep of our facilities. In accordance with the charter of the Architectural Control Committee, approved fees may be doubled if construction starts before a permit is issued, and an additional fee may be charged for handling and excessive activities that may arise. Copies showing our monthly income and expenses are available at our office.

Now I will discuss the events leading to Ms. Lloyd's getting a permit from the VVPOA for her solar. Reading Ms. Lloyd's description of these events is like reading a fairy tale. The phone messages she says were left on our Clubhouse phone on Friday, June 6th and Monday, June 9th were never found on our phone log. Keep in mind that we are an association of volunteers - we do not get paid. We are unable to have someone in our office every day.

The letter she received advised her of when the ACC met, 1-3 p.m. every Wednesday. Our Caretaker does review calls received on a daily basis and does callbacks to help answer people's questions, if he can.

Her call of June 23rd was received by our caretaker who called Ms. Lloyd back; it got to the point where he felt he could not help her. On Wednesday, June 25th, I personally called her back. I got the same thing the caretaker did. One of our directors was there experiencing these calls. She called Ms. Lloyd back to see if she could at least talk to her about her complaints, but Ms. Lloyd never answered or called her back. Our director is a witness to these phone calls. I am amazed at her description of a phone call that never took place with me.

She indicates that I told her I heard all of her messages - I received only the message of June 23rd. She quotes "now I have to listen to her." I never said that. She talks about a phone conversation I never had with her. She says the call ended up "in a heated argument." I don't know where this is coming from! I am also accused of telling her that there are rules and regulations that residents have to abide by (there are) when they live in our Villages and quotes me "do what they say." Again, I never said this. Where is Ms. Lloyd coming from? I never said these things. I did try to interrupt Ms. Lloyd so I could talk to her, but to no avail. I never had a conversation with Ms. Lloyd! And as to the information I have received, neither did anyone else in the VVPOA.

She is continually using phrases throughout her letter such as: "they don't have any legal right;" acting "regardless of Arizona law;" VVPOA is "not permitted to charge fees;" accusing us of "improper conduct;" that we use "intimidation and bullying tactics;" and finally, saying I spoke to her "in a threatening tone" in a phone call that never took place.

In the final analysis, this is all about a $75 fee, which, by the way, Ms. Lloyd never paid. We were advised early on that the company installing solar panels on Ms. Lloyd's home that they would be paying the fee. I advised her via email that as soon as we received the fee from the installation company, we would issue a permit. The permit was issued as soon as the check was received.

Again, we are all unpaid volunteers working for our Association. There is much to be done and few hands who work solely for the good of our community. I personally take care of issuing permits for all building projects, including solar installations. Ms. Lloyd was aware from the letter she received that the ACC meets each Wednesday from 1-3 p.m. at the Clubhouse to issue permits. Permits can also be issued by mail, if more convenient.

I have issued permits to many, many resident who have come to our office in the past year and a half. I also return phone calls from residents who have questions. They have all been treated with respect, courtesy and friendliness. You good folks know us and the treatment you have received at our office. I am counting on you to reject the accusations made by Ms. Lloyd in her July 22nd "Letter to the Editor."

We are here to serve the residents of the Verde Village, and it is my opinion that we volunteers do a very good job for our residents. We do our jobs legally, in accordance with the by-laws, CC&Rs, and the Architectural Control Committee charter. We rest our case.

June L. Hayes

President

Verde Village Property Owners' Assn.

Related Stories:
• Letter: Questionable tactics by Verde Village Property Assn. Architectural Control Committee


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Reader Comments

Posted: Saturday, August 9, 2014
Article comment by: Give Money Back, Apologize, And Resign

I am appalled at not only the tactics that the VVPOA employs to collect fees, the misrepresentations. You state that the VVPOA keep current with laws so how can you explain why your documents are so outdated. You do not have a legal right to charge fees and the VVPOA should return the fees back to residents who paid for a permit for solar panels as there is no requirement in your documents for same. I hope that all the residents who paid a permit fee, and will pass on this info to people who did, and believe that the VVPOA did not have a legal right to charge a fee will contact the VVPOA and request their money back . The only people that are not following the rules, making vicious attacks, issuing false info is the VVPOA. I am at a loss as to how June Hayes can state that "we do our jobs legally, in accordance with the by-laws, CC&Rs, and the Architectural Control Committee charter" when in fact these documents actually negate this. I cannot remember seeing in any of your docs that the VVPOA can threaten residents with liens or even trespass on their property and remove solar panels! Mrs. Hayes needs to read the docs more closely. Many of us are also perplexed on to what the VVPOA actually do to serve the community, as Mrs. Hayes points out that they apparently do a good job of doing it - the only thing I see that they serve is spaghetti at their monthly dinners!



Posted: Thursday, August 7, 2014
Article comment by: With Heavy Sigh

I've resided 29 years in the Verde Village. I thought I would do the right thing and pay the yearly dues to the VVPOA, then one day I received a letter from the VVPOA telling me to pay fees for improvement construction on my property. Rather than fight with these people, I payed the $200 fee they requested. Crazy thing is, that the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing, I continued to receive several letters of threat after I payed the threat fee. After that, I knew I was dealing with shysters and swore I would never pay another yearly due and I havenít. These people go at least once a week to the Yavapai County Development Services and thumb through permit applications which are available to the general public. They find an address for an application located in in the villages and BAM! youíre a proud owner of a threat letter. Thatís how these thugs operate. Iím through improving my property, and now spend my time dealing with rental property owners in our neighborhood because, instead of enforcing codes, the VVPOA too busy threatening hard working folks for improving their property and not allowing the area to become a dump, which it is fast becoming. The VVPO needs new blood with modern ideas that work, or they need to disband completely. I lost my confidence in them years and years ago. (heavy sigh)

Posted: Wednesday, August 6, 2014
Article comment by: President, Officers & Directors Out Now

I agree with other readers and come out in support of M. Lloyd, and if the President, other officers, and Directors do not resign, then a Petition needs to be started to remove these people from office and the VVPOA entirely and to return all fees that should not have been charged. We need people who care about the community, residents and the environment and who will listen etc., and not charge residents fees for improving their own property and the community, especially since they have already paid for and obtained the necessary permits from the County. The VVPOA have no legal right to charge fees for approval permits for solar panel installation as there is no mention of same in their Building Regulations, Bylaws or CC&Rs, and should immediately refund every resident who paid a fee for this permit. We do not need people running this Assoc. who viciously attack residents (as they have with M. Lloyd), threaten with liens, blatantly lie, and make misrepresentations and are not acting in compliance with their own and Arizona laws (how does Mrs. Hayes have the audacity to say that they do their due diligence when their own docs are dated 1993, 2009 and 1971). I saw on another site that Mrs. Hayes and Vogler (Treasurer) are continuing to attack Ms. Lloyd and are lying again - this time about their standing with the AZ. Corp. Commission, when it is as clear as daylight on the ACC web site that they are not in good standing. I also called the ACC yesterday and they confirmed that the VVPOA are delinquent in filing their annual report - 3 years in a row! Mrs. Hayes and the other Directors need to issue a public apology and refund fees.

Posted: Wednesday, August 6, 2014
Article comment by: Mary Heartman

@ Really? and Incorrect Forum
I don't agree. A letter to a local newspaper is probably the best way to get questionable practices out in the open, and an online forum is certainly the best way to air differences of opinion.

There are other courses of action:
M. Lloyd could hire a lawyer to send a cease and desist letter to VVPOA.
She could file a complaint with the County Board of Supervisors.
She could organize an ad hoc committee of aggrieved Verde Villagers and present VVPOA with a list of practices they want corrected.

But this could be overkill. Many Verde Villagers haven't had occasion to wonder if VVPOA has exceeded its authority. This is all new to us. Others aren't aware their case isn't an isolated instance and either haven't complained or did so privately. If perceived problems can be resolved simply by publishing them, isn't that preferable to legal action, an appeal to authority, or creating small antagonistic action groups within the community?


Posted: Wednesday, August 6, 2014
Article comment by: This is craziness

I feel for Ms. Lloyd, and I understand there are expenses to be paid to maintain a clubhouse. Maybe the powers that be could come up with some interesting events that people would enjoy going to and paying for. Then these silly fees for solar panels(?!) wouldn't have to exist! I especially don't like cookie cutter houses, which I know aren't in the Verde Village, but I really don't like these practices, telling people they need to pay for something that is not true!

Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014
Article comment by: Anyone game?

Maybe everyone should all join en masse, kick out the present perpetraitors and change the bylaws to reflect what they want and need in 2014?

Just what is it that the VV residents want that a neighborhood association might provide?

How could they attract members?

Make the clubhouse more available as a community gathering space.

They obviously need some new ideas for a tired, old, outdated association.



Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014
Article comment by: VV Resident

The VVPOA is technically already shut down. Don't you realize they can send all the letters they want . . . they have absolutely NO ABILITY to enforce any of their threats. In order to put a lien on one's home, one needs a shyster and court fees. A shyster won't even get out of bed these days without a 5k retainer. So it really does not matter WHAT the bylaws say, the point is moot without court fees and a shyster.

Since the founders of Verde Village HAD NO infinite wisdom (in the area of opressive HOA's back then, thank God) . . . our association is VOLUNTARY, as such, only those with no life bother to join. As a volunteer organization, the association administration is sketchy at best, you heard that from the President herself.

Therefore no members, no money, no shysters. Their letters are just empty threats.

Lived here for decades, received nothing but membership bills and nasty letters. But everything on my property is LEGAL with the county, the only entity who does have the power to make my life miserable.

So what has the VVPOA done for us? ABSOLUTELY nothing except exert their imaginary power over us.

Did they organize over the water increases? Did they support residents who wanted chickens? (I was told it did not matter what the county said, our bylaws don't allow chickens)

YEAH? Well sue me! LOL

Do they ever ASK the residents HOW they could actually be of service to us?

Maybe then they might actually get members?

I am not interested in spaghetti dinners or a pool and clubhouse I don't use.

But I would be interested in ORGANIZING to create a community we ALL can be proud of, a community of neighbors . . . not adversaries.


Posted: Monday, August 4, 2014
Article comment by: I Believe

The VVPOA needs to be shut down and disbanded. Sell the clubhouse and swimming pool and donate the proceeds to charity.

At the very least, lets elect some people to the board who will pledge to do nothing and enforce nothing.

We don't need no stinking VVPOA permits or VVPOA fees. We have county, state, and federal government bodies that already do that.


Posted: Monday, August 4, 2014
Article comment by: AZ Revised Statute Does Apply to VVPOA

Actually Mrs. Hayes, you are incorrect about the Arizona Revised Statutes as they do apply to the VVPOA as according to the definitions, this Statute does pertain to the VVPOA. Under ARS 33-1802 Definitions: 1. "Association" means a nonprofit corporation or unincorporated association of owners that is created pursuant to a declaration to own and operate portions of a planned community...
2. "Community documents" means the declaration, bylaws, articles of incorporation, if any, and rules, if any.
ARS 33-1816. Solar energy devices reasonable restrictions fees and costs. A. Notwithstanding any provision in the community documents, an association shall not prohibit the installation or use of a solar energy device as defined in section 44-1761, which states
1. "Collector" means a component of a solar energy device that is used to absorb solar radiation, convert it to heat or electricity and transfer the heat to a heat transfer fluid or to storage.
Yes, Mrs. Hayes, solar panels are a solar device! Therefore, if you are not permitted to prohibit the installation of solar panels according to Arizona law then you should not be charging a fee for an approval permit. None of the VVPOA documents - Bylaws, Building Regulations, or CC&Rs - actually state $75 only the word "fees" and no mention of solar panels. The only one is the Minutes that states "small fee for solar panel installation" but again no amount, but the Minutes does not constitute being a Bylaw or a Building Regulation and the latest Building Regulation is dated 1993 and the Board Meeting was on 9/2/13. I not only agree wholeheartedly with M. Lloyd but believe everything she said that transpired.


Posted: Monday, August 4, 2014
Article comment by: M Lloyd

I am not going to dignify myself with a response to the misrepresentations and remarks in June Hayes' letter. However, I would like to respond to someone's post to verify that even if one is not a member (it is voluntary and I am not a member) they still demand that residents pay permit fees and to the reader about publishing the documents, I am unable to do so directly through this forum. I am happy to make available via email the letter demanding $150, the Bylaws dated March 2009 (their current ones! - which only mentions membership fees and not permit fees), the Board Meeting Minutes dated 9/2/13 (which does not state $75 only a "small fee" for solar system installation and this is the only mention in any docs of solar), the Building Regulations Revised 1/1/1983 and 8/2/1993 (which does not mention solar panels or an installation fee amount at all). There is in fact no mention of this $75 (or in fact any fee) in any document. (The Regulations and the Bylaws also do not mention that if one does not respond in 14 days, then the permit fee goes up $75). One can draw their own conclusions from these documents whether or not the VVPOA are correct in charging a $75 fee (does $75 even constitute being a small one), and whether they are following Article 2(2)'s requirement in that there is no amended document following the 9/2/13 Board Meeting. The facts are supported by the VVPOA's own documents. Please email me at VerdeVillageDocs@outlook.com if you would like to peruse them, as well as the Arizona Corporation Commission Notices to the VVPOA dated 9/12 and 9/13 and VVPOA's current "Not in Good Standing" status.

Posted: Monday, August 4, 2014
Article comment by: Henry Daley

im an owner of a home in verde village,
the home owner association is VOLUNTARY, therefor i chose not to join, and choose not to listen to there BS policy's that don't apply to me, i can care a less about using their run down crummy clubhouse, or the nasty swiming pool


Posted: Monday, August 4, 2014
Article comment by: uncommon sense uncommon sence

Verde village vvpoa is full of windbags and
ambulance chasers.


Posted: Monday, August 4, 2014
Article comment by: Striking Similarities

between the VVPOA and the county Land use Department.

Posted: Sunday, August 3, 2014
Article comment by: uncommon sense uncommon sence

Their Ego maniacs with a twist of Power Ninja
on steroids and library law books.


Posted: Sunday, August 3, 2014
Article comment by: President Needs to Resign

This letter is full of inaccuracies. Ms. Lloyd did not once refer to the VVPOA as an HOA in her letter. ARS 33-186 does state an association and does not state either a HOA or a POA: "Notwithstanding any provision in the community documents, an association shall not prohibit the installation or use of a solar energy device as defined in section 44-1761" - VVPOA is an association. Ms. Lloyd's letter is not filled with vicious attacks at all - all she has done is advise the community of the tactics used by the VVPOA to collect money, challenged the VVPOA's procedure and the fact that there are no mention of solar panel installation fees in the 2009 bylaws. Ms. Lloyd clearly stated that at the time of writing her letter she had not received any docs - VVPOA sent them about 5 weeks later - so no, she did not know about the fees though they are not in the Amended 2009 bylaws anyway. The VVPOA are not in compliance with their bylaws as there is no bylaw that mentions solar panels. The minutes in fact do not even mention $75 - only a small fee. Ms. Lloyd did not make any personal attacks on anyone at the VVPOA and I find it appalling that June Hayes is making dishonest and defamatory remarks and states that she personally called Ms. Lloyd and then says that they never had a conversation and implies that Ms. Lloyd is delusional. Mrs. Hayes should issue a public apology to Ms. Lloyd and then submit her resignation. Other people have commented that the VVPOA have also threatened them. You have shown your true colors, Mrs. Hayes, your vicious attack on someone who felt it necessary (and pleased she did) to bring public awareness of the VVPOA's tactics etc. is disgusting.


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